Australian cattle 'sledgehammered to death' in Vietnam

[Shadowstar1922]

Btw... not once have i told anyone to go vegan, just giving facts.

There are different lifestyles when it comes to your diet. Each one is respectable and works, but some, like a vegan or vegetarian diet is simply not affordable to others.

The fact of the matter is, is that someone of my financial income cannot achieve this diet, as much as I would love to. I hate the slaughter industry in America and my dad, who is a butcher, goes on many rants on how it is disgusting and he compares it to concentration camps all the time.

There should be a massive reorganization of that industry because right now it is so inhumane to shove cattle against a wall, hook their utters up to a machine, and constantly put them through pain.

[The Divine Potato]

1. I'm sorry but eating Mcdonalds every day is a choice, not an only option. As I said, resourcefulness not greed.

2. OBVIOUSLY you wouldn't cook it all at once, please use a little common sense here.

3. Don't be biased... There are plenty of non-halal slaughter houses which abuse animals before they die and where the bolt to the head does not work. I would prefer it if you didn't target religion based killings to make the rest look okay, because I think that is really quite unfair. The basis of Halal slaughter is to keep it as natural as possible, not with any other intervention, not to make it more cruel for the animal. It isn't against the belief of just the workers, but an entire religion. Yes, you may not agree with their methods, but that does not make you a better person because you bolt an animal in the head before killing it so it is 'less painful', because quite often the bolts fail to work and the animals are still killed whilst conscious, they do not wait and bolt them again.

4. Do you guys really believe that animals feel no emotional pain, that they actually have no want to live???? There are so many videos online of animals trying to escape slaughter, screaming for their lives, so how is that okay???? Because they are worth less???? You need a privilege check. How is it fair for mothers who lose their children, for animals who have tails and beaks and wings removed whilst being totally conscious... Cause that is what happens... How do you think you can drink milk? Because a mother cow is forcefully impregnated, then her baby is taken away from her to either be killed or turned into another dairy cow finally she is hooked up to a pumping machines for days on end to the point where they get mastitis. Do you know what mastitis is? It is an infection in the breast tissue caused by blocked milk ducts, this produces pus and blood which is kept in the milk you drink, just bleached white during processing. Sorry, but during this torture, they are not sedated, and you pay for that every day.

I shall now proceed to target my arguments toward each point.

Firstly not everyone likes the taste of vegetables and fruit, if you were not aware, people are very different and financial situations call for people to make a balance between what they like to eat, and what they need to eat to live. WE HAVE PEOPLE LIVING OFF OF FOOD BANKS, do you not understand the implications of this? People cannot afford food. Period, not fruit not vegetables nor steak or burgers, they take what gets them through.

Secondly I addressed that in one of my four points which have most likely not been read by the above poster.

Thirdly I was targeting them as they are the ones highlighted in immediate sources for the "religious non-stun" method of brutally slicing a still-conscious animal's throat open.

Fourth. I love animals, I believe they posess a soul, I believe they all feel each and every one of them. However, just like people you value certain animals over others, like the way you put a pet above a farm animal you would very much put a family member above a complete stranger. About the mistreatment of cows, I definitely think it is wrong, however. I believe strongly in Darwinism, a stronger species will subjugate and domesticate another just as humans have for thousands of years. Veganism is a boycott on an aspect which has existed in humans since the dawn of our evolution, an attempt to repent for the sins of people who you don't even know and do not know you. Meat was essential for our cavemen ancestors to survive and grow. Observe the show 10,000BC to witness the prefound physiological and psychological effects our ancestors could have went through had they lived solely on nuts and berries, and very small amounts of meat. Also the show is very entertaining. It all comes down to us as a species of why we can't seem to cope without fighting with our own species, let alone hurt and torture and grossly mistreat animals.

[J the J]

Btw... not once have i told anyone to go vegan, just giving facts.

There are different lifestyles when it comes to your diet. Each one is respectable and works, but some, like a vegan or vegetarian diet is simply not affordable to others.

The fact of the matter is, is that someone of my financial income cannot achieve this diet, as much as I would love to. I hate the slaughter industry in America and my dad, who is a butcher, goes on many rants on how it is disgusting and he compares it to concentration camps all the time.

There should be a massive reorganization of that industry because right now it is so inhumane to shove cattle against a wall, hook their utters up to a machine, and constantly put them through pain.

Most vegans I know in Australia (my family included) and many other parts of the world earn less than that each year, and could not survive on an omnivorous diet because they just can't afford it... I really believe if your dad or even yourself took a little time to research into things a little more you may find it will be easier for you if you really wanted to be veg or vegan. You do not need to buy frozen meals, you can do cook ups of your own and freeze for later consumption.

*edit* you can also grow some of your own foods

[J the J]

1. I'm sorry but eating Mcdonalds every day is a choice, not an only option. As I said, resourcefulness not greed.

2. OBVIOUSLY you wouldn't cook it all at once, please use a little common sense here.

3. Don't be biased... There are plenty of non-halal slaughter houses which abuse animals before they die and where the bolt to the head does not work. I would prefer it if you didn't target religion based killings to make the rest look okay, because I think that is really quite unfair. The basis of Halal slaughter is to keep it as natural as possible, not with any other intervention, not to make it more cruel for the animal. It isn't against the belief of just the workers, but an entire religion. Yes, you may not agree with their methods, but that does not make you a better person because you bolt an animal in the head before killing it so it is 'less painful', because quite often the bolts fail to work and the animals are still killed whilst conscious, they do not wait and bolt them again.

4. Do you guys really believe that animals feel no emotional pain, that they actually have no want to live???? There are so many videos online of animals trying to escape slaughter, screaming for their lives, so how is that okay???? Because they are worth less???? You need a privilege check. How is it fair for mothers who lose their children, for animals who have tails and beaks and wings removed whilst being totally conscious... Cause that is what happens... How do you think you can drink milk? Because a mother cow is forcefully impregnated, then her baby is taken away from her to either be killed or turned into another dairy cow finally she is hooked up to a pumping machines for days on end to the point where they get mastitis. Do you know what mastitis is? It is an infection in the breast tissue caused by blocked milk ducts, this produces pus and blood which is kept in the milk you drink, just bleached white during processing. Sorry, but during this torture, they are not sedated, and you pay for that every day.

I shall now proceed to target my arguments toward each point.

Firstly not everyone likes the taste of vegetables and fruit, if you were not aware, people are very different and financial situations call for people to make a balance between what they like to eat, and what they need to eat to live. WE HAVE PEOPLE LIVING OFF OF FOOD BANKS, do you not understand the implications of this? People cannot afford food. Period, not fruit not vegetables nor steak or burgers, they take what gets them through.

Secondly I addressed that in one of my four points which have most likely not been read by the above poster.

Thirdly I was targeting them as they are the ones highlighted in immediate sources for the "religious non-stun" method of brutally slicing a still-conscious animal's throat open.

Fourth. I love animals, I believe they posess a soul, I believe they all feel each and every one of them. However, just like people you value certain animals over others, like the way you put a pet above a farm animal you would very much put a family member above a complete stranger. About the mistreatment of cows, I definitely think it is wrong, however. I believe strongly in Darwinism, a stronger species will subjugate and domesticate another just as humans have for thousands of years. Veganism is a boycott on an aspect which has existed in humans since the dawn of our evolution, an attempt to repent for the sins of people who you don't even know and do not know you. Meat was essential for our cavemen ancestors to survive and grow. Observe the show 10,000BC to witness the prefound physiological and psychological effects our ancestors could have went through had they lived solely on nuts and berries, and very small amounts of meat. Also the show is very entertaining. It all comes down to us as a species of why we can't seem to cope without fighting with our own species, let alone hurt and torture and grossly mistreat animals.

I do not put any animals life over another, that is what veganism is. How has the Darwinsim theory worked for the planet? Global warming, pollution, the list goes on. Just because it has been happening for a long time does not make it right. At one point it was legal for people to kill others based on their skin colour, race, mental capacity etc.

If it is impossible to live healthily without meat and dairy how have people been living 100+ years being vegan their whole life? Why am I how I am, totally healthy, no deficits and the same for the rest of my family?


SMART NOT SELFISH.

[The Divine Potato]

I will make up a British shopping list of the past stated goods to make up the curry that J has previously stated using our nation's largest supermarket, ASDA, part of the Wal Mart family and with critically acclaimed low prices.

Lentils (both green and red, and 500 grams) £1.10 ($1.70) (times it by two it's £2.20 or $3.41)

Potatoes (Albert Bartlet, 2 kg bag) £2.25 ($3.49) (times the price by two and for four kg mind you it is £4.50 or $6.97)

Rice (Akash Basmati, 5 kg bag) £8.00 (£12.39) (and to match J's 10 kilos we multiply that by 2 to get £16 or 24.78, more than the whole meal costs for J to make)

Spices (for this I will use curry powder. 80g "hot curry powder") £1 ($1.55)

Papadams (I am assuming that they are what you call poppadoms, 30g bag) 50p ($0.77)

(Miss out the costs of the other "small" ingredients)

Lets add together the cost of everything now. In British pounds it is £24.20 or a whopping $37.49

Low-income families in britain would rather spend their money on something that gives more taste and carbs and calories so that they don't freeze to death walking along the streets.

[The Divine Potato]

1. I'm sorry but eating Mcdonalds every day is a choice, not an only option. As I said, resourcefulness not greed.

2. OBVIOUSLY you wouldn't cook it all at once, please use a little common sense here.

3. Don't be biased... There are plenty of non-halal slaughter houses which abuse animals before they die and where the bolt to the head does not work. I would prefer it if you didn't target religion based killings to make the rest look okay, because I think that is really quite unfair. The basis of Halal slaughter is to keep it as natural as possible, not with any other intervention, not to make it more cruel for the animal. It isn't against the belief of just the workers, but an entire religion. Yes, you may not agree with their methods, but that does not make you a better person because you bolt an animal in the head before killing it so it is 'less painful', because quite often the bolts fail to work and the animals are still killed whilst conscious, they do not wait and bolt them again.

4. Do you guys really believe that animals feel no emotional pain, that they actually have no want to live???? There are so many videos online of animals trying to escape slaughter, screaming for their lives, so how is that okay???? Because they are worth less???? You need a privilege check. How is it fair for mothers who lose their children, for animals who have tails and beaks and wings removed whilst being totally conscious... Cause that is what happens... How do you think you can drink milk? Because a mother cow is forcefully impregnated, then her baby is taken away from her to either be killed or turned into another dairy cow finally she is hooked up to a pumping machines for days on end to the point where they get mastitis. Do you know what mastitis is? It is an infection in the breast tissue caused by blocked milk ducts, this produces pus and blood which is kept in the milk you drink, just bleached white during processing. Sorry, but during this torture, they are not sedated, and you pay for that every day.

I shall now proceed to target my arguments toward each point.

Firstly not everyone likes the taste of vegetables and fruit, if you were not aware, people are very different and financial situations call for people to make a balance between what they like to eat, and what they need to eat to live. WE HAVE PEOPLE LIVING OFF OF FOOD BANKS, do you not understand the implications of this? People cannot afford food. Period, not fruit not vegetables nor steak or burgers, they take what gets them through.

Secondly I addressed that in one of my four points which have most likely not been read by the above poster.

Thirdly I was targeting them as they are the ones highlighted in immediate sources for the "religious non-stun" method of brutally slicing a still-conscious animal's throat open.

Fourth. I love animals, I believe they posess a soul, I believe they all feel each and every one of them. However, just like people you value certain animals over others, like the way you put a pet above a farm animal you would very much put a family member above a complete stranger. About the mistreatment of cows, I definitely think it is wrong, however. I believe strongly in Darwinism, a stronger species will subjugate and domesticate another just as humans have for thousands of years. Veganism is a boycott on an aspect which has existed in humans since the dawn of our evolution, an attempt to repent for the sins of people who you don't even know and do not know you. Meat was essential for our cavemen ancestors to survive and grow. Observe the show 10,000BC to witness the prefound physiological and psychological effects our ancestors could have went through had they lived solely on nuts and berries, and very small amounts of meat. Also the show is very entertaining. It all comes down to us as a species of why we can't seem to cope without fighting with our own species, let alone hurt and torture and grossly mistreat animals.

I do not put any animals life over another, that is what veganism is. How has the Darwinsim theory worked for the planet? Global warming, pollution, the list goes on. Just because it has been happening for a long time does not make it right. At one point it was legal for people to kill others based on their skin colour, race, mental capacity etc.

If it is impossible to live healthily without meat and dairy how have people been living 100+ years being vegan their whole life? Why am I how I am, totally healthy, no deficits and the same for the rest of my family?


SMART NOT SELFISH.

Darwinism has formed the basis of all life on earth, a lion will eat you, and it won't have any qualms about how painfully it does. An elephant nearly bit a man in half once in an attack, cows attack people aswell. Capitalism is what has brought global warming, pollution and all those other nasty things. It WAS impossible to live as a vegan, only because of modern technology. BUILT ON THE BACKS OF ANIMALS AND HUMANS ALIKE, has your diet been afforded. Peasants in the middle ages in britain lived in vegetables and fruit, cabbages and turnips and the like, they were lucky if they hit forty. For many other reasons of course, but diet had very big factors, on how it had such little nutrition.

[Shadowstar1922]

Btw... not once have i told anyone to go vegan, just giving facts.

There are different lifestyles when it comes to your diet. Each one is respectable and works, but some, like a vegan or vegetarian diet is simply not affordable to others.

The fact of the matter is, is that someone of my financial income cannot achieve this diet, as much as I would love to. I hate the slaughter industry in America and my dad, who is a butcher, goes on many rants on how it is disgusting and he compares it to concentration camps all the time.

There should be a massive reorganization of that industry because right now it is so inhumane to shove cattle against a wall, hook their utters up to a machine, and constantly put them through pain.

Most vegans I know in Australia (my family included) and many other parts of the world earn less than that each year, and could not survive on an omnivorous diet because they just can't afford it... I really believe if your dad or even yourself took a little time to research into things a little more you may find it will be easier for you if you really wanted to be veg or vegan. You do not need to buy frozen meals, you can do cook ups of your own and freeze for later consumption.

*edit* you can also grow some of your own foods

We literally have 2 dollar hamburgers every night. Or chicken burgers, chicken nuggets, sometimes fries. Once and a while he'll buy fruit. Once every couple of months he'll save money to do takeout, or maybe once a year we'll go to a restaraunt?

My average dinner costs around 4 dollars. I don't eat lunch or breakfast, the only time i do is at school when i can find a quarter for breakfast.

Ontop of that, my dad is still paying student loans, he's trying to get a new car, credit card debt, rent is high, healthcare is high and pointless bc it covers barely anything.

Don't you dare talk to me as if you know my situation. My father is a smart man and knows how to spend money well. We have no other choice but this. As much as I hate it, I cannot change it and neither can he.

For the last and final time, If I had the money, I would go vegetarian. But I cannot.

[The Divine Potato]

Btw... not once have i told anyone to go vegan, just giving facts.

There are different lifestyles when it comes to your diet. Each one is respectable and works, but some, like a vegan or vegetarian diet is simply not affordable to others.

The fact of the matter is, is that someone of my financial income cannot achieve this diet, as much as I would love to. I hate the slaughter industry in America and my dad, who is a butcher, goes on many rants on how it is disgusting and he compares it to concentration camps all the time.

There should be a massive reorganization of that industry because right now it is so inhumane to shove cattle against a wall, hook their utters up to a machine, and constantly put them through pain.

Most vegans I know in Australia (my family included) and many other parts of the world earn less than that each year, and could not survive on an omnivorous diet because they just can't afford it... I really believe if your dad or even yourself took a little time to research into things a little more you may find it will be easier for you if you really wanted to be veg or vegan. You do not need to buy frozen meals, you can do cook ups of your own and freeze for later consumption.

*edit* you can also grow some of your own foods

We literally have 2 dollar hamburgers every night. Or chicken burgers, chicken nuggets, sometimes fries. Once and a while he'll buy fruit. Once every couple of months he'll save money to do takeout, or maybe once a year we'll go to a restaraunt?

My average dinner costs around 4 dollars. I don't eat lunch or breakfast, the only time i do is at school when i can find a quarter for breakfast.

Ontop of that, my dad is still paying student loans, he's trying to get a new car, credit card debt, rent is high, healthcare is high and pointless bc it covers barely anything.

Don't you dare talk to me as if you know my situation. My father is a smart man and knows how to spend money well. We have no other choice but this. As much as I hate it, I cannot change it and neither can he.

For the last and final time, If I had the money, I would go vegetarian. But I cannot.

The second post by J is a direct contradiction to the first one. I definitely see the bleakness in your situation Shadow. And not everyone owns a garden, J, or an allotment.

[Shadow00]

I did not read anything past the basic "go vegan don't eat meat you b-tard" thing and well, among other things that eating McDonalds every day is a choice.
Well yeah it is.
I like burgers .
They are nice to eat. They are tasty. They are juicy. I can add stuff on em and make them better.
You know what I DONT like? Vegetables. You know why I'm not a vegan when I might as well could've been?
Eating that stuff is ALSO a choice, not mandatory.
And Well mainly because I eat what pleases me mostly, I'm not gonna go ascetic cause you feel sorry for some cattle.
In fact we here(Greece) literally pierce lambs with a lance, roast them for like 6 hours and eat them EVERY YEAR for the past AT LEAST 200 years. And it fricking ROCKS.
Is it right? Why the hell not.
Is it humane? I don't even care.

[Vienna]

Animals need to be treated with care and payed reverence.

I don't care where you're from, constraining a frightened animal and killing it slowly by delivering blunt-force trauma is dishonouring a life. To show so much contempt for something sacrificed that will feed people is barbarick and inexcusable. Vietnam culture as a whole has little benevolence towards other living animals. I would like to see that change.

Change, everywhere. (I'm looking at you, too, Japan! Canada! For shame...)

For now, I completely agree with witholding freights of cattle and other livestock from such countries, until the time where they have established sustainable means to hold/slaughter animals in a humane manner.